Cupped Floor
- Thread starter Dan
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Looks to me like there are times the crawlspace has a lot of water.
FYIfloors
Well-Known Member
Surely someone should have checked the crawlspace before the install
Looks pretty wet under there and boy has the plastic degraded
Personally, I like that rustic look.
LeePelletier
Well-Known Member
Cupped floors are always a moisture issue. It is not the foundation shifting, which would cause a different distortion.
In short, there is more moisture on the bottom of the planks than there is on the top. Moisture causes wood to swell. Therefore, the bottom of the plank swells more than the top because there is more moisture there. This causes cupping.
Severe cupping can permanantly damage the wood. The solution is to address the moisture. Crawl spaces, in my experience, are areas that routinely experience moisture related issues and it is best to address this before the floor is laid.
DO NOT address the cupping by sanding the floor flat and refinishing it. There may be a time of year when the crawl space is relatively dry, and if and when that happens the bottom of the boards would contract. We would then have "crowning" instead. And you would have permanantly sanded the flooring out of shape.
I joined this forum specifically to share some information about moisture related issues in wood flooring, and lo and behold, we already have someone with a problem.
I'll be adding some general information postings later, as I feel the industry as a whole does an inadequate job addressing moisture issues.
In short, there is more moisture on the bottom of the planks than there is on the top. Moisture causes wood to swell. Therefore, the bottom of the plank swells more than the top because there is more moisture there. This causes cupping.
Severe cupping can permanantly damage the wood. The solution is to address the moisture. Crawl spaces, in my experience, are areas that routinely experience moisture related issues and it is best to address this before the floor is laid.
DO NOT address the cupping by sanding the floor flat and refinishing it. There may be a time of year when the crawl space is relatively dry, and if and when that happens the bottom of the boards would contract. We would then have "crowning" instead. And you would have permanantly sanded the flooring out of shape.
I joined this forum specifically to share some information about moisture related issues in wood flooring, and lo and behold, we already have someone with a problem.
I'll be adding some general information postings later, as I feel the industry as a whole does an inadequate job addressing moisture issues.
I checked out your website Lee. Very impressive. ........it said in business since 1957. I liked that info, I've here since 1957 myself.
TheFloorguy
Member
Here in the old homes and mansions built in the 1930's, the original 2¼ x 33/32 quarter sawn Oak straight over the floor joist are all cupped to some degree... If you actually crawl under and look up. Old oiled beams and joists, and the bottom of the flooring.
But go inside and they are as flat as can be and never an issue. Some the original finish, believe it or not.
That is because it has always lived in that state. Nothing has ever changed. No more moisture loss or gain, in the boards gradient moisture.
But go inside and they are as flat as can be and never an issue. Some the original finish, believe it or not.
That is because it has always lived in that state. Nothing has ever changed. No more moisture loss or gain, in the boards gradient moisture.
LeePelletier
Well-Known Member
Narrow quarter sawn boards do wonders to minimize cupping. Problem is, people are soooooo price conscious that quarter sawn has all but disappeared. Plus, people are going with plank instead of strip.
And then, here in New England, our environmental conditions change drastically. Dry and cold in the winter. Really dry. You swear the static shock arced a foot from the lamp to your finger. And then the summer is humid, humid. That's a huge range for wood, and people need climate control for plain-sawn plank around here.
I would imagine there are parts of the country where evironmental changes are significantly less.
We have a home for special people near us. It's a grand old home with original wood floors. Currently unoccupied due to explosion damage (ink factory blew up), but those wood floors were amazing. For some clients, they would have us GLUE DOWN carpet on the wood floors. And then later, they could be sanded and refinished and looked great again. I love those old homes.
And then, here in New England, our environmental conditions change drastically. Dry and cold in the winter. Really dry. You swear the static shock arced a foot from the lamp to your finger. And then the summer is humid, humid. That's a huge range for wood, and people need climate control for plain-sawn plank around here.
I would imagine there are parts of the country where evironmental changes are significantly less.
We have a home for special people near us. It's a grand old home with original wood floors. Currently unoccupied due to explosion damage (ink factory blew up), but those wood floors were amazing. For some clients, they would have us GLUE DOWN carpet on the wood floors. And then later, they could be sanded and refinished and looked great again. I love those old homes.
Now there's some food for thought..............
Nick
In Remembrance
Always thinking about food .
Always thinking about food .
Now there some beer for thought.
Ya don't think maybe it has to due with the older homes not being so tight and breathed with the temperature and humidity swings has something to do with it?
I've seen some beautiful wood floors in old homes and there is no humidifier or dehumidifier in them.
Daris
woodguy
Active Member
I know this is an old thread, but I was wondering how this turned out. It's obvious that the floor cupped from moisture, perhaps the installer forgot to install a vapor barrier, and check the subfloor moisture level? Well I KNOW he didn't. But that crawl space gets really wet in the rainy season, I can see.
Woodguy, I recommended several things be addressed before the floor is resanded. Things like the downspouts be connected to drains, a slab back porch be covered, of course the ground cover be replaced, mold remediatioin, foundation waterproofing, etc.
The crawl space was excavated below ground level, creating what - at times - is a pool under the home. The bottom of the joists are about eight inches above exterior ground level in some areas.
The fourth picture on page one of this thread shows where water has been running down the foundation wall. On the other side of this wall is the uncovered porch.
I'm hoping these items have been addressed by now, as the wet spring rains will be coming soon, which could prove to be a good test.
The crawl space was excavated below ground level, creating what - at times - is a pool under the home. The bottom of the joists are about eight inches above exterior ground level in some areas.
The fourth picture on page one of this thread shows where water has been running down the foundation wall. On the other side of this wall is the uncovered porch.
I'm hoping these items have been addressed by now, as the wet spring rains will be coming soon, which could prove to be a good test.
Oh, by the way, in this install, the original pine floor was removed. It was flat. I'm sure it was installed and allowed to cup before it was sanded flat. I just don't understand how the subfloor and joists have survived over the years (built in 1957) in this environment.
If you notice, at some time, someone made an attempt to create a conditioned crawlspace. They just didn't quite do it right.
If you notice, at some time, someone made an attempt to create a conditioned crawlspace. They just didn't quite do it right.
carpetone
Well-Known Member
Thorough. Thanks.
My solid wood flooring is cupping. I have older wood flooring on 3 sides of the new floor. The original flooring is fine, but the new wood flooring is cupping. The company which installed the floor says that moisture reading are not normally taken when installing in a home.
Thats completely false.
