Engineered Floor Edge Peeling?

[Seleur]

Hi all - I have engineered white oak wood floors glued down over concrete. They are about 3 years old now and have been performing pretty well. In one high traffic area, one of the edges of a board seems to be a little bit lifted up / not flush, and recently when walking over it I've noticed it's making a crunching / crackling sound in the area where it's lifting. Any ideas what's going on here? Is this delamination? What's the fix here short of replacing the board? Glue? I've had good luck with Dritac in the past, but isn't that more for issues with subfloor adhesion? Photo below.

Thanks!

 

[MikeAntonetti]

Nail the hell out of it!

could be some issues with minor vertical movement, initial damage from install finally reading its head. Do you have extra pieces to see it’s internals?

 

[highup]

I'm going to go out on a limb and asume this is an engineered wood floor?
I'm probably not going to be your best source for advice so I'm just fishing so that others might be able to help you.
I'll ask more, is this an on grade slab or a basement?

 

[Seleur]

Thanks! Yes, this is engineered white oak flooring. I don't have any extra pieces left, but for whatever it's worth, it's "Graf Bros Engineered Flooring". Re: the slab - this is a high rise apartment building in NYC.

 

[Dan]

First thing to determine is if the entire board is moving on that corner of if it is just the wear layer.

Keep in mind a floor, is to be inspected from a standing (five feet up, two feet away) position under normal lighting conditions. Since you can already see and hear this issue let's get down on the floor and look closer.

How much weight does it take to cause movement? Slight pressure with a finger or do you have to push on it? If slight pressure tap on it slightly with an object. I use my fingernail to lightly thump on it. Does it make a rattle sound? Like the sound when you first tap it, then another? Like you tap it once but it sounds like really fast two sounds? Or does it sound hollow?

 

[Seleur]

Hi Dan - thank you for your advice. Slight finger pressure doesn't move it; I have to push on it with my finger. The crackling sound is also quieter when I push it with my finger; it's when I'm walking and happen to hit that spot that it really makes the crackling sound. When I tap on that corner with my finger nail, it definitely sounds less solid than tapping any other part of the board, but I don't know if it sounds like a rattle - almost more like plasticky. However, knocking with my fist sounds solid - i.e. I don't think it's a "hollow spot" along the lines of what I've seen elsewhere, where you knock and the whole thing sounds hollow.

 

[Dan]

Seleur, what you are describing does not sound like a case of delamination, which would be a manufacturing issue. What you are describing sounds more like an adhesion issue which could fall under either site conditions or an installation issue. The hollow sound is a very good indicator the flooring is not attached to the concrete in that spot. The DriTac kit could be a possible repair and is probably the most likely remedy.

 

[Seleur]

Thank you Dan. I will try Dritac and hopefully it serves me well as it has in the past. Curious: what is the remedy for delamination in case that is the culprit? For what it's worth, this does not sound or "feel" like the other hollow spots I've had, where there's a very different sound when knocking on the area. But I am sure you are much more educated on this topic than I am I appreciate the advice.

 

[Dan]

Fixing delam usually requires board replacement. Not saying a little adhesive couldn't be injected into the board, but that is normally not accepted as a repair.Replacement of a board in the middle of a room, while it does require skill, is easier than most think.

 

[MikeAntonetti]

Went to a new Gyro shop which I’m a fan of since New York City as a kid, the floor (floating vinyl plank)rocked bad in one spot, notice amplified damage. One of the worst Gyro’s I’ve ever had.

we’ve had maybe two delam repairs. Think I tried crazy glue but that did effect the urethane finish. I can’t remember what we used, maybe I was more careful. Something liquidy like water viscosity then weight is not easy to put pressure on exact spot.

wish I had power to shut a place down, these Gyro’s are horrible don’t open back up until they’re perfected.

 

[highup]

Is that one of the solid vinyl, thin gauge materials?
I just finished a carpet job yesterday in a living room. They had moved all the furniture into the dining room. Because I'm a nice guy, my brother and I moved some of the heavy stuff back in to the room. When positioning a furniture slider under one of the pieces I noticed about it 12 inch area or the planks locking edge had broken.
At some point I have a repair to attempt in one where the floor was not flattened properly and the joint was centered in a sloped area where they feather the material out. Had that particular end joint been a foot farther one way of the other, it might not have broken.
...... That said, I would have removed some underlayment rather than feather the floor out.
Those thin gauge materials ought to be glued down because the locks are too small to have any strength.

 

[highup]

I didn't start at the beginning of the topic. My bad.
I've never seen a delamination like that Mike. Do they wet mop the floor every night?

 

[C.J.]

Is that one of the solid vinyl, thin gauge materials?
I just finished a carpet job yesterday in a living room. They had moved all the furniture into the dining room. Because I'm a nice guy, my brother and I moved some of the heavy stuff back in to the room. When positioning a furniture slider under one of the pieces I noticed about it 12 inch area or the planks locking edge had broken.
At some point I have a repair to attempt in one where the floor was not flattened properly and the joint was centered in a sloped area where they feather the material out. Had that particular end joint been a foot farther one way of the other, it might not have broken.
...... That said, I would have removed some underlayment rather than feather the floor out.
Those thin gauge materials ought to be glued down because the locks are too small to have any strength.

And that is why I don’t do repairs. When it’s all said and done you’ll have ended up opening up a significant portion of that floor to fix another persons slop and you won’t make nearly as much money as you could have if you would have just gone and done a fresh install yourself. In my mind fixing other people’s slop minimizes me as a craftsman. I don’t need the attaboy, I want the chedda!

 

[highup]

And that is why I don’t do repairs. When it’s all said and done you’ll have ended up opening up a significant portion of that floor to fix another persons slop and you won’t make nearly as much money as you could have if you would have just gone and done a fresh install yourself. In my mind fixing other people’s slop minimizes me as a craftsman. I don’t need the attaboy, I want the chedda!

The only creative word they haven't described me as is 'a magician'
When someone does crappy work and you turn it into a diamond ring. People will call you out for another job down the line and pass your name on. It makes money in the end.

 

[C.J.]

The only creative word they haven't described me as is 'a magician'
When someone does crappy work and you turn it into a diamond ring. People will call you out for another job down the line and pass your name on. It makes money in the end.

Sometimes. Sometimes they call the cheap guy again knowing that they can call you to fix his slop. I’ve seen it enough that I just don’t fix other peoples shit anymore. I’ll gladly replace it though.

Didn’t you post some pics of some handyman’s sloppy install that the customer wasn’t going to use again but used again. Mmm hmm.

 

[MikeAntonetti]

I think it was a laminate. I bid a job customer had some questions about price. I said I grind the hardwood removal to the slab to allow for patch and leveler which should’ve been done prior to your floating floor that made noise all over the place before your failed hardwood was glued down. Silence continues, was thinking I should text again to say “by now I’m sure you called your retailer and told them what I said. Should there be any confusion to floor flatness no worries, the slab is in its pristine condition after the removal and we can have the retailer there for facial expression extravaganza.

 

[highup]

Sometimes. Sometimes they call the cheap guy again knowing that they can call you to fix his slop. I’ve seen it enough that I just don’t fix other peoples shit anymore. I’ll gladly replace it though.

Didn’t you post some pics of some handyman’s sloppy install that the customer wasn’t going to use again but used again. Mmm hmm.

Mmm hmm.