Finishing the carpet to wood edge

[highup]

This customer had a room built above his garage. It's a big room well over 20 by 30. He installed some 2 1/2" solid oak on the floor. I didn't ask if its on plywood or OSB. The wood was nailed down, not glued.
When he ended his boards they taper 3/4 of an inch in the 6 foot wide opening where it will meets with the green carpet.
I figured cutting the boards straight, then capping the end. The opening is 6 feet and his longest boards are 5 feet, so I figured to use 3 pieces of differing lengths to cap it.
An overlapping molding would be too tall (thick) and feel like crap when it's stepped on, so that's why I suggested capping the end. The solid 3/4" floor has micro-beveled edges, so I figure the end cap should also be done that way. I figure that it would be best to glue in a filler strip the groove side of the cap boards and cut off the tongue side............ and groove that tongue side where it will meet with the existing floor.

Once I get the end of his boards straightened across the opening, I have to make a groove in the boards that he installed and in my new end caps. All I have is a Wisonart wing bit. Will that small groove work OK? I don't want to spend money on a wide bit I will use only once............... I don't install solid 3/4" nail down, or glue down.

I'm also concerned about whether to glue and nail my end cap to the existing subfloor, or to glue end cap to the oak floor and glue the end cap to the sub floor.
.........or simply groove both sides of the joint, install a loose spline, then face nail the end cap in place with no glue on anything. Once more, the end cap would have to be made up of either two pieces or three pieces of his leftover flooring material. None of it is wide long enough to make it in one piece.

Any suggestions?

My drawing is way out of scale. The carpeted hallway is around 4 1/2 feet wide, and the 2 1/2" wide boards I drew in are obviously way wider in my drawing then in actuality. That opening is about 6 feet, so there probably ought to be 25 boards across that area.

 

[Floorist]

I would most likely face nail. Never had much faith in gluing transitions.

 

[highup]

I was wondering about that because of the length of the room. I know that the boards will barely expand in length. I'd rather not face nail tho because I'd rather see no fasteners at all. The lighting in this room hits pretty hard on this area and no matter how nice the nailing and filling is, it would show.

 

[Ernesto]

Just cut the wood straight and tuck it to the wood.
Or I use a hand held biscuit joiner, then attach the flush baby threshold. Or biscuit joiner and a return of the left over wood. But prolly isnt finished.

 

[highup]

Just cut the wood straight and tuck it to the wood.
Or I use a hand held biscuit joiner, then attach the flush baby threshold. Or biscuit joiner and a return of the left over wood. But prolly isnt finished.

The carpet is already an inch short. The opening was a straight wall before they added the room and created this doorway.
No time to order a matching baby threshold, but that's a good idea. They will be back home Saturday or Sunday after Christmas and want it done by New Years eve.
Biscuit joiner? .......I'm a floor dude, not a wood shop.
........sayin' that the Wilsonart wing bit won't work?

The floor is prefinished, so, so are his leftovers.

 

[DarisMulkin]

Get some utility tape for the Koolglide and glue it down with that.

Daris

 

[Ernesto]

I meant to say "a header" with a new piece running perpendicular to the existing. I'm thinking thats what your plan is.

 

[highup]

Get some utility tape for the Koolglide and glue it down with that.

Daris

If there was some to be found locally, it would be fun to play with it to see how it behaves. I'm wondering if it would allow the header piece to go totally flush with the existing material. I assume it has a small amount of thickness?
I was thinking of using Chemrex for something this small.

I meant to say "a header" with a new piece running perpendicular to the existing. I'm thinking thats what your plan is.

That's the plan, Stan

 

[DarisMulkin]

email me your address I may have a roll laying around or partial, I don't know for sure.

Daris

 

[highup]

email me your address I may have a roll laying around or partial, I don't know for sure.

Daris

It would be fun to try, but I need it by Tuesday at the latest. It would cost more to get it here than me buying a roll of it from a supply place 100 miles away.
I can't see much going wrong if I just glue it with Chemrex. The store I do some work out of has plastic tubes of Bostiks Best........... they look like those Nestles cookie dough packages that you get in the refrigerated section of the supermarket. Like a fat sausage tube sealed at each end with a crimped wire ring.

 

[JIMMIEM]

This customer had a room built above his garage. It's a big room well over 20 by 30. He installed some 2 1/2" solid oak on the floor. I didn't ask if its on plywood or OSB. The wood was nailed down, not glued.
When he ended his boards they taper 3/4 of an inch in the 6 foot wide opening where it will meets with the green carpet.
I figured cutting the boards straight, then capping the end. The opening is 6 feet and his longest boards are 5 feet, so I figured to use 3 pieces of differing lengths to cap it.
An overlapping molding would be too tall (thick) and feel like crap when it's stepped on, so that's why I suggested capping the end. The solid 3/4" floor has micro-beveled edges, so I figure the end cap should also be done that way. I figure that it would be best to glue in a filler strip the groove side of the cap boards and cut off the tongue side............ and groove that tongue side where it will meet with the existing floor.
To cut a groove in the ends of the boards you can get a slot wing cutter for your router and use a spline/slip tongue. I got one from Infinity for not a lot of $.

Once I get the end of his boards straightened across the opening, I have to make a groove in the boards that he installed and in my new end caps. All I have is a Wisonart wing bit. Will that small groove work OK? I don't want to spend money on a wide bit I will use only once............... I don't install solid 3/4" nail down, or glue down.

I'm also concerned about whether to glue and nail my end cap to the existing subfloor, or to glue end cap to the oak floor and glue the end cap to the sub floor.
.........or simply groove both sides of the joint, install a loose spline, then face nail the end cap in place with no glue on anything. Once more, the end cap would have to be made up of either two pieces or three pieces of his leftover flooring material. None of it is wide long enough to make it in one piece.

Any suggestions?

My drawing is way out of scale. The carpeted hallway is around 4 1/2 feet wide, and the 2 1/2" wide boards I drew in are obviously way wider in my drawing then in actuality. That opening is about 6 feet, so there probably ought to be 25 boards across that area.

Are the wood and carpet at the same height and pretty close together? If so then get some T molding that will cover the edge of the wood and the carpet. Are the boards straight across where they meet the carpeting? Are there grooves or tongues on the ends of the boards? If T molding doesn't work you should probably do a tongue and groove set up between the ends of the boards and header strip. Depending on carpet height you may have to under cut the side of the header boards that rest on the carpet. If you use a spline between end cap and board ends toe nail the spline and face nail the end cap. You said more than one piece of flooring for end cap. Nail first piece through it's tongue and face nail final piece.

 

[highup]

Are the wood and carpet at the same height and pretty close together? If so then get some T molding that will cover the edge of the wood and the carpet. Are the boards straight across where they meet the carpeting? Are there grooves or tongues on the ends of the boards? If T molding doesn't work you should probably do a tongue and groove set up between the ends of the boards and header strip. Depending on carpet height you may have to under cut the side of the header boards that rest on the carpet. If you use a spline between end cap and board ends toe nail the spline and face nail the end cap. You said more than one piece of flooring for end cap. Nail first piece through it's tongue and face nail final piece.

I can shim the carpet edge up slightly to make the height where I need it. Any T mold would make the height difference too high, so that's why a header board........... the carpet is too far away as it is, so the header would fix that issue too. I'm figuring now, to retain the tongue on the header board and to groove the edge that's on the floor with my router. My wing bit is narrow, so it will take two passes.
I'm heading off to the warehouse now to experiment with it. I need to make my jig that will span the 6 foot doorway so I can make the cut with my circular saw. One pass 1/8 of an inch deep, then the final cut. I'll score the floor first with a utility blade. I'm gonna buy a 60 tooth Freud Diablo blade and see how well it makes the cut.

 

[JIMMIEM]

I can shim the carpet edge up slightly to make the height where I need it. Any T mold would make the height difference too high, so that's why a header board........... the carpet is too far away as it is, so the header would fix that issue too. I'm figuring now, to retain the tongue on the header board and to groove the edge that's on the floor with my router. My wing bit is narrow, so it will take two passes.
I'm heading off to the warehouse now to experiment with it. I need to make my jig that will span the 6 foot doorway so I can make the cut with my circular saw. One pass 1/8 of an inch deep, then the final cut. I'll score the floor first with a utility blade. I'm gonna buy a 60 tooth Freud Diablo blade and see how well it makes the cut.

Sounds like a plan!!!! If the carpet is lower the last header board can be a reducer that will cover the edge of the carpet. Good idea to groove the edges of the existing flooring....easier than trying to create tongues. If you need more than one header board you will need a spline/slip tongue for one of the header board joints or header board to existing flooring joint.
Another way to square off the existing flooring. Screw a straight board to the subfloor a few inches from the existing floor and use your router with an edge guide that will run along the far side of the straight board. The router will rest on the existing flooring and straight board.

 

[highup]

Sounds like a plan!!!! If the carpet is lower the last header board can be a reducer that will cover the edge of the carpet. Good idea to groove the edges of the existing flooring....easier than trying to create tongues. If you need more than one header board you will need a spline/slip tongue for one of the header board joints or header board to existing flooring joint.

The board ends already have T&G ends. The boards have a micro bevel. If I remove those and and try to make the grain of two boards match............ in an effort to make it look like one single board, then I'll use the Wilsonart wing bit and make a spline.
...............boy-O-boy, can I make a 'small' project into a big one.

 

[JIMMIEM]

The board ends already have T&G ends. The boards have a micro bevel. If I remove those and and try to make the grain of two boards match............ in an effort to make it look like one single board, then I'll use the Wilsonart wing bit and make a spline.
...............boy-O-boy, can I make a 'small' project into a big one.

Do the boards that are already down have a microbevel? If so then why are you going to remove the micro bevel on the header boards? If you get a good grain match and the bevels are really small then they will almost look like one board....and even if they don't they will look good anyway. I don't know how micro your bevel is but I just used some 220 grit sandpaper to make the micro bevel on a cut end. Also, if there is no over-wood a non-beveled edge will be good.

 

[JIMMIEM]

The board ends already have T&G ends. The boards have a micro bevel. If I remove those and and try to make the grain of two boards match............ in an effort to make it look like one single board, then I'll use the Wilsonart wing bit and make a spline.
...............boy-O-boy, can I make a 'small' project into a big one.

When you first look at it it seems like a 'small' project but there are a lot of details and fine cutting and fitting which turn it into a 'BIG' project.

 

[highup]

Do the boards that are already down have a microbevel? If so then why are you going to remove the micro bevel on the header boards? If you get a good grain match and the bevels are really small then they will almost look like one board....and even if they don't they will look good anyway. I don't know how micro your bevel is but I just used some 220 grit sandpaper to make the micro bevel on a cut end. Also, if there is no over-wood a non-beveled edge will be good.

Bevel on the but end looked wider than the bevel on the length. I did a test and it looks better without the bevel on the end cut. A 6 foot opening is kind of short to add a couple of micro-beveled edges. I think it looks better without the micro-bevel after seeing it both ways. With the bevels, they really hit you in the face.
If we had more time, I would have suggested a custom colored one piece transition that matched his dark cherry bar and their matching dark cherry cabinets.
Being splined the butt joints will be identical in height, so virtually no sanding will be needed to make it look good.

When you first look at it it seems like a 'small' project but there are a lot of details and fine cutting and fitting which turn it into a 'BIG' project.

So true. It's one of those projects that looks simple once it's all done. I have well over three hours into just making the saw guide which will be custom for this 6' wide doorway. Add the time spent mocking up 10 rows of material and pinning those short pieces to some 3/4" plywood to do my spline and grooving tests.
The saw guide will be custom cut at the jobsite to exactly fit the 6 foot wide opening. Once placed, it will be screwed to the walls so it doesn't move. I'lll plunge my circular saw slowly into the guide and make one slow even cut till the saw hits the opposing wall opening. Now, I'll finish off the end cuts with a new blade in my Fein Multimaster. (the whole time, not breaking a sweat, or fainting)
Once cut, I need to groove the cut that I just made in the floor.................. and then custom cut the width and depth of the tongue in the header boards so that they mate perfectly flush in height with the existing floor.
I'm modifying the tongue of the wood slightly so I can use my Wilsonart bit. It will take two passes with the Wislonart bit to make the groove as wide (thick) as I need it to be. The tongue depth will also be reduced about 3/16 so it matches the Wilsonart bit depth.
..................oh yeah ................and then shim up the tackstrip and maybe the pad too so it makes the carpet transition look and feel absolutely maaavelus.

All in all, a couple hours to whoop it all out.............. whadaya think, a $125 minimum?

I included a scan of the practice material I put together. I will probably add a slight micro-bevel to the floor side. I wanted to see how well it looked without it for the sake of analyzing the accuracy of the cuts.
The arrows are the portion that I did with the Fein Multimaster............... obviously the circular saw can't do the entire cut. I needed to do that cut to see how well the Fein matched up with the initial cut. Pretty sweet.

 

[highup]

I bought a new 60 tooth Diablo blade, but tried out my old rarely used Matsushita blade for the fun of it. I made three trial cuts with it. They were all full depth, slow cuts without scoring the material first. Initially, I was thinking of making an initial 1/8" cut, and then a full depth cut. I got some impressively clean cuts with zero chip-out making the cuts in one pass.
What you see in the photo, if you can see it, is just dust or debris in the groove.
I'm returning that new Diablo blade.
No way can it do any better.

 

[JIMMIEM]

I bought a new 60 tooth Diablo blade, but tried out my old rarely used Matsushita blade for the fun of it. I made three trial cuts with it. They were all full depth, slow cuts without scoring the material first. Initially, I was thinking of making an initial 1/8" cut, and then a full depth cut. I got some impressively clean cuts with zero chip-out making the cuts in one pass.
What you see in the photo, if you can see it, is just dust or debris in the groove.
I'm returning that new Diablo blade.
No way can it do any better.

That is excellent work!!!! A little matching wood putty in the groove. I hope you're kidding about $125 for the whole job. I did a smaller job to make a stair nosing that the flooring installer didn't do. That included buying the raw wood, bull nosing it, grooving it for the spline, making the spline, staining, polyurethane (3 coats oil), removing 1 row of flooring, and installing.....all this for a paltry $150.

 

[highup]

That is excellent work!!!! A little matching wood putty in the groove. I hope you're kidding about $125 for the whole job. I did a smaller job to make a stair nosing that the flooring installer didn't do. That included buying the raw wood, bull nosing it, grooving it for the spline, making the spline, staining, polyurethane (3 coats oil), removing 1 row of flooring, and installing.....all this for a paltry $150.

I want a small micro-groove where the header meets against the rest of the boards, just not where the two header boards butt to each other.
I was joking about the $125. I was thinking more like $280. It's certainly going to eat up the day including the carpet work.

I've done what you did on jobs like you just mentioned. Hard to justify being more picky than the customer and going a bit overboard to impress them. When you do tho, it will come back in more work and recommendations by those customers.