Jamb Saw

[highup]

FWIW, I 'm loving that big Crain grinder saw. I wish I could remember the number. It's the one that costs around tree fitty. I hated the adjustment mechanism at first, but once I got used to it, I love it. The ergonomics are what makes it great. Its got big balls too. It doesn't have that big gaping mouth my 812 had, but that's what makes it more stable.

I endorse.

I don't know of the adjustment mechanism you're talking about but quite often you can modify things a tiny bit because the factory skimped and cheaped out on something quite obvious.
In 87 I bought a set of crane steel pin dividers. The center screw that tightened up the dividers was a freaking star, or lock washer.
Every time you adjusted the dividers, it would gouge out the aluminum housing in a big way.
I threw out the star washer and put in a sandwich of two brass washers with a rubber o-ring between them.
That was in the late 80s and I still have these dividers and they work great.
Even with new tools, the industry idiots screw up a good thing. Don't despair because you can fix whatever they screwed up.

 

[Tile Tom]

The only reason I drag out my jamb saw anymore is for old homes with the thick ass jambs for lath & plaster or for masonry. Like under cutting a hearth.
Other than that it's my multi tool for the win!

 

[Floorist]

In the 70s at the old Armstrong school, we were taught to cut vinyl and lino "neat". We never undercut the doorways. So I seldom did. Seldom saw a reason to do it.

 

[DarisMulkin]

In the 70s at the old Armstrong school, we were taught to cut vinyl and lino "neat". We never undercut the doorways. So I seldom did. Seldom saw a reason to do it.

Me also and today all I can say it undercutting just makes more headaches for the homeowner having to replace the trim. If it was antique trim in my house that was under cut would be grounds for killing.

 

[Mark Brown]

Hell, I undercut jambs and trims for carpet, tile, vinyl, lino, hardwood, laminate... you name it. I undercut metal, wood, mdf, stone.... I think you get the idea.

Looks better and cleaner. I jave the crain standy upy big guy and I wouldn't trade it for the world. I have a metal blade, wood blade and diamond carbide blade.

 

[Floorist]

Hell, I undercut jambs and trims for carpet, tile, vinyl, lino, hardwood, laminate... you name it. I undercut metal, wood, mdf, stone.... I think you get the idea.

Looks better and cleaner. I jave the crain standy upy big guy and I wouldn't trade it for the world. I have a metal blade, wood blade and diamond carbide blade.

I can trim almost anything and make it look good without undercutting. Back in my day, you learned how to do it right. No shortcuts were allowed.
Try undercutting in a multi-million dollar old home that has been restored. You would get sued for the damage.

 

[Mark Brown]

It has nothing to do with trimming things to look good. It's a style of finish. I hate gullies, so carpet gets undercut. Laminate and wood are obvious and vinyl, well blow me over if someone wants to cry their life away about 1/8 of an inch of a jam, that isn't a me problem.

Equating it to skill is a foolish argument as it has nothing at to do with it. Right now I'm installing 6 foot water tight flash coving in shower rooms, im fairly sure I know how to cut a door flush to trim. It just looks better under. No sealer, no gaps, no shrinking, no curl. Better.

 

[Floorist]

It has nothing to do with trimming things to look good. It's a style of finish. I hate gullies, so carpet gets undercut. Laminate and wood are obvious and vinyl, well blow me over if someone wants to cry their life away about 1/8 of an inch of a jam, that isn't a me problem.

Equating it to skill is a foolish argument as it has nothing at to do with it. Right now I'm installing 6 foot water tight flash coving in shower rooms, im fairly sure I know how to cut a door flush to trim. It just looks better under. No sealer, no gaps, no shrinking, no curl. Better.

Never had a piece of vinyl shrink or curl in a doorway. Installed it for 40+ years.
You should ask the customer before you undercut the trim.

 

[Mark Brown]

Why would anyone assume I dont?
I'm huge on communicating with folks, most the time they go along with me.... because I communicate. I would never stand up and say one way is or is not better than the other, but i will say what I prefer. There simply is no "best" way to do just about anything in this trade but there are a whole hell of a lot of grey area options.

 

[DarisMulkin]

I can trim almost anything and make it look good without undercutting. Back in my day, you learned how to do it right. No shortcuts were allowed.
Try undercutting in a multi-million dollar old home that has been restored. You would get sued for the damage.

And we did it with Armstrong Montina and corlon.

 

[C.J.]

One of the things you guys are not taking into consideration, and it’s also a lesson I had to learn when I was working in the office and looking at effed up jobs, ‘It’s not what you can do, it’s what the guy going out there to do the work can do’. There is a serious lack of training anymore. The average installer working at HD, LL, Lowes, Empire or even the local shop down the road that isn’t at least 50 and been installing since they were knee high to their daddy’s nut sack, do they even know how to make a pattern for vinyl. Alright never mind the shit shops, what about other installers working for mid level shops? This is just how it is now. There is only one Daris, one Floorist, one Jon… and you guys are all aging out of the game. The next round of installers ain’t got what you guys got. The average installer out there these days is gonna undercut n go if they even undercut at all. Shit, I undercut cus I’m not working on million dollar restored mansions and when I leave the job looks good and the customers are happy and that is what pays the bills.

 

[Mark Brown]

I'm under 50 by a wide margin and pattern scribe, ageism buddy

 

[Floorist]

One of the things you guys are not taking into consideration, and it’s also a lesson I had to learn when I was working in the office and looking at effed up jobs, ‘It’s not what you can do, it’s what the guy going out there to do the work can do’. There is a serious lack of training anymore. The average installer working at HD, LL, Lowes, Empire or even the local shop down the road that isn’t at least 50 and been installing since they were knee high to their daddy’s nut sack, do they even know how to make a pattern for vinyl. Alright never mind the shit shops, what about other installers working for mid level shops? This is just how it is now. There is only one Daris, one Floorist, one Jon… and you guys are all aging out of the game. The next round of installers ain’t got what you guys got. The average installer out there these days is gonna undercut n go if they even undercut at all. Shit, I undercut cus I’m not working on million dollar restored mansions and when I leave the job looks good and the customers are happy and that is what pays the bills.

I made a lot of extra money fixing stuff after other's installations. Several, I just said no. Some there was no hope of repairing. For instance, a metal spiral staircase where every step was cut short. Replaced it all. A hallway that had seven doorways in about 20 feet. The hall had not been stretched, No was my answer. One where the guy put a double row of strip out in a room where the seam should be, and stapled the carpet to the strip. He not only did not know how to make a seam, he did not own an iron.

 

[Floorist]

I think my favorite was back in the 80s, underlayment installed over rubberback and nailed with roofing nails. I was supposed to install $30 a yard vinyl on it, uh, no.

 

[Mark Brown]

One where the guy put a double row of strip out in a room where the seam should be, and stapled the carpet to the strip

That is the best thing I think I have ever heard in my entire life, well at least as far as floor covering stories go.

The really sad bloody part of this trade is to be a "wizard" at it, all one really has to do is be fairly decent and not entirely brain dead.

 

[highup]

And we did it with Armstrong Montina and corlon.

But with these new soft materials if you fit it a couple thousands too tight it can buckle on you. Those old materials you can put pretty damn tight and that's what made them look so neat. No way today would I try and fit materials that way. It gets undercut and looks exactly the same as if you put the floor down and somebody put the casing on top which happens.
That said the last 6 months I've installed 10 ft of linoleum and that's about it. Off the top of my head, i don't recall the last time I installed any vinyl.
I don't care to either.

 

[Mark Brown]

Ramjamming mineral backed products was great fun. Cut a hair big and out comes the old banana jammer and voila, perfection. You start jamming away on some glassbac and well, things do not go as planned. Outside of the handling, which is wonderful, I find it a much harder task to work with the cushion back vinyls. They do not cut as clean, hook knives some times bunch them up, for lack of a better term and if you aren't holding a knife dead on 90 cutting seams on the thicker versions, your life will be bad.

In the last 6 months I have installed over 4000 yards of commercial vinyl and there is only about six thousand to go. Sadly, none of it is undercut because well.... who has the time to undercut steel doors when there are 600 of them lol

 

[C.J.]

I’ve heard it’s against code to undercut steel door jambs. The new glass backed vinyl will just pooch up later if not immediately if you try to jamb too much.

I’ve also found that you damn near have to let the glass back products lay out flat overnight to avoid bubbles as well. Half the time I would get the material in the morning and it was rolled up inside out as well as it was cold out. Not the best recipe for getting a flat/ bubble free end result.

 

[Floorist]

I’ve heard it’s against code to undercut steel door jambs. The new glass backed vinyl will just pooch up later if not immediately if you try to jamb too much.

I’ve also found that you damn near have to let the glass back products lay out flat overnight to avoid bubbles as well. Half the time I would get the material in the morning and it was rolled up inside out as well as it was cold out. Not the best recipe for getting a flat/ bubble free end result.

Some of those vinyls say to roll inside out.

 

[Mark Brown]

I’ve heard it’s against code to undercut steel door jambs

Depends on if they are a fire/smoke break, or just a steel door jamb for the sake of being a steel door jamb. My favorite is when dummies come running out of the wood work to tell you not to undercut a steel door jamb because it is against "code" and neglect to realize they are hollow, have wooden hollow doors hung on them, are interior to a unit and are already off the ground and lack fire caulking.

There are a very great amount of things that people just do not question, yet they heard one thing one time and that was their gospel