Laying Engineered flooring to meet up with stairs

[jocasio]

Good morning all:

I am about to embark on my wood flooring project. I am laying engineered wood throughout my house and I wanted to get some advise. Basically, my upstairs is as denoted in the jpg I have attached. I have a few questions regarding the project. 1) I understand that it is more asthetically pleasing to have the board run perpendicular to the windows. However, as you can see my floor joists run perpendicular to the window, so I am going to run them parallel to the windows, so they are perpedicular to the joists. By doing this, the boards will run parallel along the longest wall in my master bedroom as well as parallel though the hallway. My question is this is this OK to do? Should I rethink my strategy? The other issue this poses is how to make sure they end up so that I can put a stairnose and have it meet perfectly with the lst row laid along the hallway. I'm a bit confused as to how to make it work out perfectly if I run the boards down the hallway (in the image, left to right) so that I do not have o cut a piece off at the stairs, or add a sliver to make the stair nose butt against the flooring.

I hope this is not too confusing, but please ask questions if there needs to be clarification.

Many thanks!

Juan

 

[FloorMaven]

Start at the stair nose and lay some boards out dry.

 

[LeePelletier]

Run perpendicular to your joists. In your case, this will run the boards the long way down the hall, which is generally preferable asthetically, and make abutting your stair nosing a better fit.

You want to run perpendicular to your joists for the added dimensional stability it will provide.

 

[jocasio]

Thanks for the responses.

LeePelletier: Do you have another suggestion regarding the placement of the boards as they pertain to the stair nose? I need to make sure they butt up against the stair nose perfectly, otherwise I may have a gap or a board that is too wide, and I don't want that.

I will definitely try dry fitting them from the stair nose that when I start on the project (I am currently working on tiling my master bath now), but I'm not sure if I can make sure I lay the boards perfectly straight, since the stairs are only 31" wide.

Floormaven: Once I lay them out dry from the stair nose to the window wall of my master bedroom, where should I mark my line? Should it be at the starting point of my window wall or several feet out?

Thanks again for all of your help.

 

[LeePelletier]

You are not going to dry-lay that much flooring (from the stair nosing to the window wall in the master bedroom). You will open and spread about three boxes of wood (or more) at a time so you can work in variations in color so your floor is more uniform.

You are going to place your stair nosing where it should be. You can then begin your dry-lay at the stair-nosing. Do your cuts to fit around. You can move the stair nosing a little so you don't have a thin strip running along the wall in the hall. Or you can cut it a little bit. Not too much, or it won't be as stable as you want it to be. Use a quality construction adhesive for the stair nosing. Top nailing is not necessary if the adhesive is quality.

You will butt the groove side of your wood to the stair nosing. Fill the groove with construction adhesive, so the stair nosing will be connected with your first board once you press them together and nail that first board in. Clean any excess adhesive immediately. It's best to control the adhesive carefully as it is better to not have excess adhesive "squish out" if you can help it.

Before you do any of this, do a moisture test. Don't forget the moisture test.

 

[DarisMulkin]

Lee , curious as to why the moisture test? Looks to me like it is a wood floor.
Duh!!! Brain fart!!! I relized after making the post it was the moisture content between the substrat and the wood. Sorry!!

Daris

 

[jocasio]

Thanks Lee:

So are you suggesting I work from the stair nose? The stair nose has the groove so how will I nail the floor down? Is there a piece that would goinside of the groove on the stair nose and the first board I lay if I start at the stair nose? I beleive there is a piece (I recall seeing it in some other instructions somewhere), but I don't know the name of it.

Thanks again!

Juan

 

[Ernesto]

Its called a spline or slip tongue

 

[LeePelletier]

LOL. Oh, my.

Jocasio, Floor Maven did not steer you wrong. Your layout makes staring at the stair nosing practical. In a lot of the condos we do around here, there is a transition piece that gets placed at the unit entrance, and we are staring from that point.

Yeah, I have stair nosings that are flat, and some that are grooved on the side. Let's call the groove "someone's bright but impractical idea". Here's why. It implies that we can install the entire floor, and then slip that stair nosing over the last board and have it line up properly. With wider plank flooring popular today, that's a fantasy. It will happen once in a while, but it's nothing you can count on. So we ignore what the stair nosing implies. We put the stair nosing in, in your case, and then turn the boards around to nail them. We are not going to put the tongue into the groove, because then you have no way of installing your floor, unless you are going to glue the entire floor. Assuming you have a suitable substrate, that's a waste of time and money. Nailing/stapling is so much faster. And wood glue costs a bunch.

Now I've seen people put the floor in and the stair nosing last. And we get a bonehead thin strip of wood right before the stair nosing. Don't do this! That's exactly where you don't want a stripped board.

No, there is a not a "piece" that fills in that space. Good quality construction adhesive. It's not designed as a filler. Everyone will tell you that.

Why do you want to adhere the nosing to the next board? It helps eliminate sagging by providing just a bit more dimensional stability. I can't believe how many jobs I've seen where everything is great, but that stupid stair nose sags just a bit. Totally preventable.

Now, despite what the home centers and HGTV imply, is flooring a great do-it-yourself project? Ahhhh, no. There is so much knowledge that you don't have (basing on the questions you are asking), that I'm going to suggest you hire a professional. A true professional is probably booked up a little while (not available next day). Let them do their thing. And you can do what you do best to earn the money to pay them. Better result all around. This is probably the best piece of advice I've given yet.

 

[FloorMaven]

Its called a spline or slip tongue

This is probably the best option. If you dry lay some boards from the nose to say the center of the hall you can mark the exact spot you need a row to be so you can terminate with a full board at the stair nose. If you use that reference mark to make a straight, parallel line the length of the hall and BR you now have a line of reference to measure from to see how the width of all your rows will terminate. If you are happy with that (its not like you have a lot of options anyway) you can start on that line or make any adjustments you see fit.

If you are mechanically fastening the floor (staple/nail) you will do as Stephen suggested and use a spline so you can work in both directions.

 

[FloorMaven]

Thanks Lee:

So are you suggesting I work from the stair nose?

One other thought...you can really start anywhere you like once you have your reference line but the further away from the stair nose you start the more you invite conditions out of your control to affect the width of the last board. For instance the human condition, you may not lay every row equally as tight to the adjacent rows or a board might not be absolutely straight leaving a small gap, indistinguishable but never the less affecting the width of your last row.

 

[jocasio]

Thanks all for you help. It is true that I am not a pro at this , but I am pretty handy. I've helped install wood flooring for a couple of neighbors, but it was always on the main level of the homes and not upstairs.

Ernesto: Thanks, I do remember this being the option for coming out of one room, down a hall and back into another romm where you had to turn the boards into the room to nail down (as Floormaven suggested work both ways).

My initial apprehension for starting at the stairs was because it was s narrow and not 100% guaranteed to be square with the walls. But given this seems to be a great suggestions (and something I actually thought about), I'll give it a shot. I'll use my laser square to check for square after I dry lay a few boards down my hallway. This will also have the added benefit of using the spline only at the stair nose and one room, instead of three rooms had I started in the master bedroom.

Just one more question regarding the spline: Can I use any wood glue to gle the stair nose to the spline and then to the first board? Any suggestions on type of wood? I also have engineered wood adhesive as my main level is on a slab. I've already conducted the moisture test (and in fact I'm replacing 11 year Bruce engineered wood).

Thanks you all for the help!