Soundproofing

[David Warren]

I put in hardwood flooring in my apartment. The people downstairs said that it made it too noisy for them and the management said I had to put in wall-to-wall carpet, which I did. Now the downstairs person is still claiming it is noisy and they tell me that I should have removed the hardwood flooring before installing the carpet. I think they just want to complain. Is it normal to remove a hardwood floor before installing wall-to-wall carpet? It doesn't make sense to me. How can removing another layer of substrate add to the noise?

Thanks.
Warren

 

[C.J.]

Were your neighbors watching the installation of the carpet? If not then how would they know you didn’t have the hardwood floors removed.

 

[DarisMulkin]

i'd tell them to pee up a rope and suck on the wet end. I cleaned it up.

 

[JPfloor]

No, it doesn't make sense. The additional layer of hardwood would add to the soundproofing and make for a lower decibel reading at the level below. A thicker, denser pad would help reduce the sound even more.

I believe the technical term used in the flooring industry for your downstair neighbor is "Kookernutter"....

 

[David Warren]

No, it doesn't make sense. The additional layer of hardwood would add to the soundproofing and make for a lower decibel reading at the level below. A thicker, denser pad would help reduce the sound even more.

I believe the technical term used in the flooring industry for your downstair neighbor is "Kookernutter"....

JP Floor, Thanks for your response. It doesn't make a bit of sense to me why ripping out the hardwood floor would make it more soundproof. In fact I too thought the extra layer would make it more soundproof. But I thought that maybe there is something I don't understand. Your reply makes me assured I did the right thing.

 

[C.J.]

There is some legitimate science behind it. Is it installed right up against the walls? Was it fastened to the joists through a sound isolation membrane? Prolly need more details but it is possible that the addition of the hardwood could have increased the ease of sound transmission.

 

[JPfloor]

There is some legitimate science behind it. Is it installed right up against the walls? Was it fastened to the joists through a sound isolation membrane? Prolly need more details but it is possible that the addition of the hardwood could have increased the ease of sound transmission.

Well maybe but I would think the plywood under the hardwood would be fastened to the joists. That would still be the case if you remove the hardwood. Hardwood isn't generally nailed directly into the joists. Not usually installed right up against the wall either. I believe I would agree with that theory if you were walking directly on the hardwood floor creating the clacking vibrations (Wouldn't wanna live under a tap dance studio) but with the carpet and pad on top I would think the extra thickness of the wood would only help to deaden the sound transmission... But it's true, I'm not a scientist...

We'll have to break out the sound meter and get a decibel reading...

 

[JPfloor]

Here’s a little scientist type stuff I found that you could throw at you downstairs neighbor…

“Deflection

Deflection of sound is achieved by adding mass and density to any structure such as a wall, floor or ceiling.

All solid materials which have a thick consistency and are dense or somewhat heavy, can help to block sound.

By adding mass and dense materials between the source of the sound and the receiving point will offer additional bulk that the sound wave will have to pass through and in doing so will reduce its energy.

Increased mass and density of a wall ‘s construction can be achieved with concrete for example, or dense finishing boards such as ply, OSB, drywall or plasterboard.

Deflection with mass and density proves more effective with airborne sounds such as voices or music, and not so effective with impact noise such as foot fall, which is usually associated with stronger power, pressure and therefore vibration.

As sound waves strike the mass and dense materials, vibration will occur and in doing so will pass the energy from one side to the other through the materials’ own rigidity.

This is the principle of flanking transmission noise – a common problem with all structural scenarios.”

There’s a lot more to read if you’re interested…

https://www.acoustiblok.co.uk/sound...is cleverly converted to a trace heat energy.

 

[C.J.]

I would say that is correct but without knowing all the details I couldn’t say for sure that the downstairs neighbor is crazy.

What if the upstairs apartment is gypcrete and a layer of plywood was fastened to the joists through the gypcrete. Or what if the wood itself is tight against the walls thereby making sound transmission to the structure, and downstairs, just that much easier. Could be both of those AND the downstairs neighbor is crazy.

 

[JPfloor]

Could be rabbit, could be.

We did a lot of high-end condos where the upper level units were gypcrete. In the units we glued down solid roll rubber underneath the engineer wood floors. High density, Half inch thick, very expensive. Did it work? We did an awful lot of them so I’m guessing it worked to some extent. Most of the owners put area rugs over the wood anyway.

The corridors were all double stick carpet installation. Over the gypcrete that was pretty darn quiet.

 

[David Warren]

You folks are the best. Thanks for all this great information.

Dave

 

[highup]

There is some legitimate science behind it. Is it installed right up against the walls? Was it fastened to the joists through a sound isolation membrane? Prolly need more details but it is possible that the addition of the hardwood could have increased the ease of sound transmission.

Might have made the floor more rigid?

 

[highup]

I'd say if they want it quieter if they need to have the landlord create a sub ceiling under your floor and insulate that.
I think if you put carpeting on your floor then it's not your issue anymore. It's the structure of the apartment. Combine that with a crazy neighbor and you got what you got.
...now maybe if you quit walking on the floor that would help a lot.

 

[DarisMulkin]

Another thought you go down and listen for yourself if the neighbor below will let you in. Then you can hear[maybe] what he is talking about.