Wate based floor finish................... what's the trick?

[highup]

On my stair treads, I was surprised at the amount the wood grain raised on the first coat. I wanted the stain dry thoroughly, so I put the Varathane oil based stain on the treads Friday evening, and put the first coat of Varathane water based floor finish on them Monday about noon. I was told to put on 2 coats before sanding lightly. I sanded extremely lightly after the first coat was dry.............. Just enough to knock off the very highest points.
Then I put on coat 2 and let it dry overnight.
Today before coat 3, I again sanded quite lightly, just enough to knock off the very highest points. I knew that the first two coats didn't amount to much, and I didn't want to hit the stain.
I put on coat 3 today, then a couple hours later, coat 4, then coat 5 went on about 6:30 tonight. No sanding after coat 3.
It looks pretty decent right now, but I bet one more coat, then possibly a very light sanding, plus a finish coat would make it perfect.

Varathane says a minimum of 4 coats. I felt that I was putting on the coats on at a fairly liberal rate........... not excessive tho.
I used a 4" hot dog roller with a short nap mohair like cover. It was a Purdy item.
I dipped the roller in the tray, and leaving it saturated pretty heavy, slobbered on a 4 inch swath down the back side.
I dipped the roller again, and made a pass through the center of the tread, then one more dip in the finish made the third pass. (4" X 3 passes = a tread width)
Next, I rolled the Varathane to and fro in different directions to even out the coat, then did a very light back brush along the length of the tread to get rid of any minor bubbles. I followed this sequence on all 5 passes. It felt like the right amount of finish was applied evenly each time.

Like I said. They do look pretty nice after 5 coats. I vacuumed and wiped down each tread and riser each time I recoated them.
That said, 5 coats still didn't fill in all the wood grain to make the surface finish look glassy smooth.
Is six or seven unrealistic? I know with an oil based finish, 3 coats might have done the job.

Raised grain like this is new to me. Am I experiencing something unusual, or is this the norm for an water based finish? Sees like lot of coats to hide the raised grain. Is there a better way? Maybe I should have done two super thin coats as the first coats?
Fill me in if you can on using non catalyzed water based finishes.

 

[highup]

Here's the product.
http://www.rustoleum.com/~/media/Di...e/CBG_Varathane Interior WB Polyurethane.ashx

With 5 coats on the treads, plus one coat on the underside of the tread plus 4 coats on the riser pieces, I come up with about 320 sq feet.
The real world coverage from that PDF says about 340 to 370 ft per gallon.
I still have over a quart left out of that gallon. Maybe I should have put on more material per coat.................... or maybe I just need more coats.
This is new to me. I don't finish wood floors. I've only used a similar product (BM's Stays Clear) on small pieces of trim like for custom made wood reducers. Large or wide pieces like a solid oak tread are a first for me. On smaller pieces, like trims, I didn't notice much grain raise.
I do like the Varathane product's behavior, working time and drying speed. You do need to keep moving along so it doesn't start to grab or drag, but once you figure out its behavior, its not bad to work with. It dries pretty fast and it seems to dry pretty hard in just a couple of hours when it's ready to sand.

 

[JIMMIEM]

Here's the product.
http://www.rustoleum.com/~/media/Di...e/CBG_Varathane Interior WB Polyurethane.ashx

With 5 coats on the treads, plus one coat on the underside of the tread plus 4 coats on the riser pieces, I come up with about 320 sq feet.
The real world coverage from that PDF says about 340 to 370 ft per gallon.
I still have over a quart left out of that gallon. Maybe I should have put on more material per coat.................... or maybe I just need more coats.
This is new to me. I don't finish wood floors. I've only used a similar product (BM's Stays Clear) on small pieces of trim like for custom made wood reducers. Large or wide pieces like a solid oak tread are a first for me. On smaller pieces, like trims, I didn't notice much grain raise.
I do like the Varathane product's behavior, working time and drying speed. You do need to keep moving along so it doesn't start to grab or drag, but once you figure out its behavior, its not bad to work with. It dries pretty fast and it seems to dry pretty hard in just a couple of hours when it's ready to sand.

I've never used a water based poly. You mentioned that you put a coat on the underside of the treads.....are you going to use adhesive to attach the treads to the risers?

 

[highup]

I've never used a water based poly. You mentioned that you put a coat on the underside of the treads.....are you going to use adhesive to attach the treads to the risers?

Chemrex 948 is what to planned to use.
http://www.buildingsystems.basf.com...ildingsystems/products/items/docs/948_tdg.pdf
Back of the tread has one coat. It feels like 20 grit sandpaper because of the raised grain. I planned on scuffing the area that contacts the stringer if that's what you're asking.

 

[Jeff]

Sounds like you put the finish on to thin to me. What you did should be fine.


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[highup]

I was thinking that too, but they said 4 coats minimum. I did a couple of extremely light sandings between a couple of the coats. It just took a lot to fill in the grain. The soft grain was pretty deep. After coat 5, I sanded it good with 220 then with 320, and gave it two more coats. Came out real nice.
I just don't think is has a high enough solids. I think about 30% or slightly under that.

 

[JIMMIEM]

I was thinking that too, but they said 4 coats minimum. I did a couple of extremely light sandings between a couple of the coats. It just took a lot to fill in the grain. The soft grain was pretty deep. After coat 5, I sanded it good with 220 then with 320, and gave it two more coats. Came out real nice.
I just don't think is has a high enough solids. I think about 30% or slightly under that.

Red Oak is porous and grainy. A pore filler can be used to fill the pores so that less coats of finish will be necessary. FWIW, oil flooring poly is noticeably thicker than regular poly and will require less coats to achieve a smooth glassy finish than the regular poly. Don't know if the same is true for the water based products but I am not surprised that more coats were needed to get the glassy finish especially with red oak that wasn't treated with pore filler.

 

[Nick]

The stuff you buy in the store is only 20% solids , compared to the 80% solids we used in the Bowling alleys .

They make a clear coat you brush on before you stain . Closes the grain, and you won't get darker and lighter colors in the stain. the board will all look the same.

 

[highup]

A wood conditioner? Benjamin Moore's from what I recall has a brownish tint to it.
The Varathane has about 26% solids. Yours is 2 parts tho. I knew beforehand there was a difference between the catalized types and the oil based ones. The oil drys to slow and had a lot of sting factor that the homeowner didn't want.
This was a totally new experience for me, so I got an education in doing the finish work. Now I know what to expect in future wood working projects that involve a water based finish.