Gas is down to $3.34 here. Bought some in K.C. last Monday for $3.29.
Gas
- Thread starter Floorist
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I just went to Costco and spent $4.54 for regular gas. It is killing us folks in California!
Nick
In Remembrance
Depending where you go it is $3.60 to $3.85
FloorMaven
Well-Known Member
havasu said:
California is second in the nation with almost 49 cents a gallon state tax.
http://taxfoundation.org/article/state-gasoline-tax-rates-january-1-2012
Here it ranges from $3.37- $3.69. Gas up on Monday when it was $3.75.
Daris
Daris
Here's an interesting article on the Trans-Canada Pipeline for all you drill baby drill people. Even the enourmous oil find in the Dakotas has not dropped the price of oil. In fact, it has gone up.
Snip: "This is a foreign company," Crawford said. "Most people believe that as this product gets to the Houston area and is refined, it's probably then going to be shipped outside the United States. So if this product is not going to wind up as gasoline or diesel fuel in your vehicles or mine then what kind of energy independence is that creating for us?"
http://xfinity.comcast.net/articles/finance/20121017/US.Oil.Pipeline.Texas.Landowners/
Snip: "This is a foreign company," Crawford said. "Most people believe that as this product gets to the Houston area and is refined, it's probably then going to be shipped outside the United States. So if this product is not going to wind up as gasoline or diesel fuel in your vehicles or mine then what kind of energy independence is that creating for us?"
http://xfinity.comcast.net/articles/finance/20121017/US.Oil.Pipeline.Texas.Landowners/
Ern I read an article this summer that we export a crap load of gas and oil already. Don't ask for the article, I don't remember when or where it was.
I googled and found this:
http://content.usatoday.com/communi...orted-more-gasoline-than-imported-last-year/1
Daris
I googled and found this:
http://content.usatoday.com/communi...orted-more-gasoline-than-imported-last-year/1
Daris
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Yup Daris, and no one can stop them from doing it. Big oil always has an excuse.
I say, and your not going to like this but.......... government owned oil refineries. Competition is the only thing they understand besides profits.
Just like healthcare.
I say, and your not going to like this but.......... government owned oil refineries. Competition is the only thing they understand besides profits.
Just like healthcare.
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We export REFINED petroleum products Daris basically shipping back some, essentially NEGLIGIBLE (to the global market) percentage of what we import with "value added" from U.S. labor/industry. Oil producers can ship it here, have it refined and sell the gas/diesel or whatever globally cheaper than they can have it refined and sold elsewhere. All we could accomplish with tariffs or policies to prevent this is hurt domestic refineries-------labor and capital investment, crippling that industry in the face of DECREASING domestic demand.
It's really just a reflection of OVERCAPACITY in the refining sector here after the economic crash of 2007-2008.
*************************************Yup Daris, and no one can stop them from doing it. Big oil always has an excuse.
I say, and your not going to like this but.......... government owned oil refineries. Competition is the only thing they understand besides profits.
Just like healthcare.
We could stop this in a heartbeat Ernesto but I wouldn't recommend it as I believe it would just as likely INCREASE the domestic price of gas at the pump.
Our refineries NEED to import crude oil and export the refined products or else they will close down and declare bankruptcy. With less refining capacity the price of gasoline and diesel will CERTAINLY not go down on the retail level.
This isn't an issue subject to simple solutions. It's EXTREMELY complex and we are NOT in control of many of the critical factors.
$3.30 today.
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Yeah, here's a story from a website I follow:
http://www.theoildrum.com/files/Pet...011_PET_MOVE_WKLY_DC_NUS-Z00_MBBLPD_W (1).jpg
Our Gulf Coast refineries are increasingly working with Latin American countries that have tons of crude oil but lack the facilities to refine their own. So that's a turnaround thing------oil in, gas & diesel out. The industry argument is that discouraging those exports does not get those refineries to sell into U.S. markets rather that production will go offshore and we lose the jobs. In theory that capacity could be sold to the U.S regions like the East Coast that now imports from Canada and Europe. But there are different supply/demand curves and delivery issues that make that unprofitable or infeasible for the same reason Mexico and Brazil import from us.
Building a refinery some places isn't practical and not just because people don't want the pipelines in their back yards and refineries pumping smoke next to the playground. There's all kinds of logistic nightmares getting the infrastructure for these massive facilities.
To me it makes some degree of sense that excess gasoline supply in Europe and Canada can be sold along the Eastern as Seaboard as cheaply or cheaper than it can be moved from the Gulf. It all comes down to if you want to allow the market to function and serve the producers and high bidder or if you believe government can "regulate" the market to improve the value to the consumer. Most times government hacks just fuck everything up because..........you really don't want some sloppy, ignorant whores in Congress dictating highly critical infrastructure and market dynamics.
To be clear. I'm not against regulation. It's just only a good thing where the people regulating the market are competent and honest. I don't think we have anyone like that in Washington DC.
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The elementary school I worked on for a few months last year was right near the major refineries in Long Beach
https://www.google.com/search?q=wil...TFiwLk4IDQDg&ved=0CAoQ_AUoAQ&biw=1208&bih=540
That whole area is overwhelmed by the infrastructure from these refineries as well as the largest port in the world. When I drive around there sometimes I like to stop by the roadside to take it all in. We don't get down into the "guts" of the economy very frequently. It's not pretty but it's jaw dropping how LARGE and endless this stuff runs on for.
When people try to understand the price at the pump, natural gas, solvents, air fare and such they ought to visit a site like these to take in the enormity of it.
Man does it look COMPLICATED!
DISCLOSURE: I own stock in COP which recently spit out some (stock split) shares of PSX; their refinery business. So maybe I'm biased.....LOL.
https://www.google.com/search?q=wil...TFiwLk4IDQDg&ved=0CAoQ_AUoAQ&biw=1208&bih=540
That whole area is overwhelmed by the infrastructure from these refineries as well as the largest port in the world. When I drive around there sometimes I like to stop by the roadside to take it all in. We don't get down into the "guts" of the economy very frequently. It's not pretty but it's jaw dropping how LARGE and endless this stuff runs on for.
When people try to understand the price at the pump, natural gas, solvents, air fare and such they ought to visit a site like these to take in the enormity of it.
Man does it look COMPLICATED!
DISCLOSURE: I own stock in COP which recently spit out some (stock split) shares of PSX; their refinery business. So maybe I'm biased.....LOL.
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Costco gas last night was $4.37. Whoopie!
$3.27 tonight.
What gets me with these new pipelines coming down from Canada is. All we ever hear is excuses from the oil companys as to why prices are high. You've heard them all I am sure and incognito is spot on about them.
But here is one major excuse they use allot, is lack of refining capacity and cost of building new refineries. So....if you got new piplelines coming down with millions of gallons of low quality oil shale crude, where's this refining capacity going to come from?
But here is one major excuse they use allot, is lack of refining capacity and cost of building new refineries. So....if you got new piplelines coming down with millions of gallons of low quality oil shale crude, where's this refining capacity going to come from?
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Those refining issues are primarily impacting regional cost differences. It NOT driving the national averages. Efficiencies are going to hindered by all kinds of environmental, NIMBY, political, geographical and economic constraints.
The GLOBAL prices of crude will dictate what we pay nationally on average for a gallon of gas. So those regional refining capacity issues can be confounding to a real understanding of what we're up against.
The pipelines from Canada and North Dakota are of particular benefit to my stock holdings in COP and PSX as I believe they are both prime investors or otherwise vested. This oil and gas will be harvested and brought to market some day and at some price point. It's presently a slow and expensive source that simply doesn't have significant GLOBAL impact, ESPECIALLY if that oil is piped to the Gulf of Mexico to be refined exporting the fuel products-------------not sure if even that has significant impact even on regional gas prices.
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